Will Kane turn on Orton?

[Will]

Ill give you Ziggler, but come on Ryder? The guy was a joke.

[the madscotsman]

But He still got over and he got over alot better and alot quicker than alot of other talents that get big pushes.

[Will]

But He still got over and he got over alot better and alot quicker than alot of other talents that get big pushes.

Thats true but when he got a chance to get over on the big stage, he failed miserably. On one hand that's the wwes fault, they mishandled his push. On the other hand it was also Ryders fault, he built a character that got over in spite of not getting a push and when the wwe got behind him the fans moved on.

[Big Evil]

WWE and especially Vince don't like when a talent doesn't use the WWE 'machine' to become a star. They tried to capitalize on his popularity outside the ring way too late, and by then the fans didn't want to continue supporting him. He went nowhere and kept getting squashed despite the support he was getting.
Ziggler can get the fans behind him and he seems to have kept a level of popularity for quite some time now. The WWE just won't give him a chance on the big stage ever since his injury ruined his first run after the cash-in on Del Rio. What disappoints me more is the fact that they won't even give him a run as IC or US champion. They don't want to put any title on him, but keep the titles on Sheamus and Barrett almost as if they are trying to keep them relevant in case of a call-up to the main event scene.
If WWE keeps burying guys and knocking others down the ladder then there is going to be a serious problem in the near future with stars not being developed. I can almost picture a scene with Vince, Trips, and Steph looking at the WWE locker room and wondering who they can take out of the mid-card talent they have and force the WWE title onto. Point being, there won't be any main event caliber stars, but a whole bunch of contenders for tag team, IC, and US gold. The WWE will bury themselves by not taking chances and pushing guys to the top. They are being way too reliant on the past stars and the guys that had been through the proving grounds to become stars. The issue seems to be that the proving grounds are gone with the stars like Michaels, Undertaker, Triple H more or less, Jericho, The Rock and others that have been mega-stars leaving the ring. We don't have anybody aside Cena, Orton, Kane, and Triple H to prove themselves against. Sure Jericho shows up for a program every six months or so, but even that isn't enough. The WWE used to forge stars by testing their mettle against the best in the world, and now most have retired or moved onto other things.

[Will]

Zigglers pushes keep getting stopped because he wont shut the hell up not because the WWE doesn't think he can be a star or doesn't want to push him. He hurts himself with comments that he makes in interviews more than anyone else in the company.

[the madscotsman]

Zigglers pushes keep getting stopped because he wont shut the hell up not because the WWE doesn't think he can be a star or doesn't want to push him. He hurts himself with comments that he makes in interviews more than anyone else in the company.

So he's not entitled to free speach then. Is that what you're saying.

[Will]

So he's not entitled to free speach then. Is that what you're saying.

That's exactly what I'm saying. Free speech doesn't exist in corporate America. At least not if you want to succeed or if your not the one calling the shots.

[the madscotsman]

Fair point.